How to play nut flush draw on flop

[maddo]

Is this an acceptable way to play the nut flush draw on the flop? I'm hoping to get a call from a second best flush draw, but did I bet too much. I suppose it's good I won the hand, but maybe there's more to be made with hands like this? What's a good strategy here? How do others play this situation?



Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t40 (8 handed)

CO (t1100)
Button (t2090)
SB (t2105)
BB (t1210)
UTG (t1225)
Hero (t925)
MP1 (t865)
MP2 (t480)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG folds, Hero calls t40, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, CO folds, Button calls t40, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t160) 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets t160, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds.

Final Pot: t320

[poboys]

[ QUOTE ]
Is this an acceptable way to play the nut flush draw on the flop? I'm hoping to get a call from a second best flush draw, but did I bet too much. I suppose it's good I won the hand, but maybe there's more to be made with hands like this? What's a good strategy here? How do others play this situation?


[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think this is a terrible way to play the hand. This is a classic semi-bluff. But, betting out the pot won't encourage non-nut flush draws to chase. You are representing TPGK or better with your bet, so players that have anything less than AK (and who believe you) won't play either. If someone does have an AK, and they call, and yuo do hit your flush, chances are they won't put you on a flush draw.

You are a 2:1 dog here, but are laying 1:1 at the time of your bet.

Just curious, what would you do if:
1-A player calls at the turn is not an A, nor a /images/graemlins/spade.gif?
2-A player re-raises your pot bet?

[stupidsucker]

I think limping to start with was the bad idea.
I sometimes try to buy the pot on a nut flush draw, but in early position like you are I dont like it. If you get a caller and miss the turn you cant bet again.

Check/fold it if someone makes a big bet, or bet small yourself hoping to get a few callers and no raises. Then try to pick it up on the turn if you miss, or check/raise if you hit the turn.(maybe slow to the river if you hit the turn and someone is biting big.)

But limping with Axs early is normally a big mistake already.

[maddo]

So are you saying I should fold or raise with this hand in this position? If I raise the standard 3xBB and get reraised then there's no way I can call is there? I'm only risking t40 to see what could possibly a big earning flop. Is this bad play? Ok, if someone raises more than 2xBB after me, then I fold it. Should this hand be folded straight away no question?

[kenewbie]

[ QUOTE ]
Is this an acceptable way to play the nut flush draw on the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes. The worst case scenario when you are semi-bluffing your 4 to a flush is getting reraised for a large amount, you want to bet enough money for that not to happen.

Also, if your bet is quite large then your opponent is less likely to take the lead if you check the turn.

And forget about trying to get opponents with inferior hands to come along. You are on a draw, you want to take this pot now. Save the stringing along for when you actually have a hand.

k

[TheCat]

To semi-bluff or not to semi-bluff that is the big question. Depends on the table. If you're up against calling stations don't even think about a semi-bluff (or any sort of bluff) if you simply check they will usually give you good implied (or even pot) odds to draw. They rarly protect a made hand correctly. I do this most of the time.
However if you on a tight table then semi-bluff is a very good play. If you miss on the turn you can consider another semi-bluff before the river card. It's one of those very tricky marginal plays we have to make all the time, use your skill and judgement. Even if you just check after the turn you might get a free card.

[Hood]

If you are up against calling stations and you expect them all to call if you bet the pot, it's not a semi-bluff, you're betting for value. You're 4:1 to make your flush on the turn, and if 4 people are going to call you, then betting is a +CEV move.

Although I guess with short stacks it may not be +$EV.

[TheCat]

Ok, qualify what I say about calling stations.

If the pot is multiway with more than 4 opponents, all of whom are calling stations you are correct to get as much money into the pot as you can with a nut flush draw.
Watch out if the board pairs though.

[maddo]

To answer question 1. I remember trying this recently, and I had one caller in a later position. The turn didn't help but didn't appear to be too dangerous, so I bet the whole pot again. I was called again. Now the pot is quite big. I missed on the river, but made a small bet anyway, and he folded. Maybe he was calling with a second best flush? I guess this type of play is very risky, but can be rewarding.

[maddo]

Incidentally, how do I get the maximum out of my opponent if I hit a flush on the river (and I know it's the nut hand)? Do I bet all-in? Make a smaller bet which they must call, and hope that they have a flush and will raise? Surely checking is very foolish as I may not get any more chips.

???