How do you guys play these flops?

[cold_cash]

Just looking for a little info or some ideas about how to play strong hands when the flop is really coordinated.

I usually lean towards playing these fast, as I don't like to give credit for a flopped monster. On the other hand, it sucks when you play these fast and the turn/river ends up bringing the fourth card to a straight or flush.

Hand 1

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 handed)

Preflop: Hero 9/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="666666">2 folds</font>, SB calls, <font color="666666">1 fold</font>, UTG calls.

Flop: (7 SB) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">SB bets</font>, UTG calls, Hero...




Hand 2 (I don't have the HH, so I'm going from memory)

Hero is BB with J /images/graemlins/club.gif 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif

5 limpers, Hero checks.

Flop: Q /images/graemlins/club.gif T /images/graemlins/club.gif 8 /images/graemlins/club.gif

SB bets, Hero...


I think Hand 1 is a little more clear cut than Hand 2, but I think you understand my question.

Thanks in advance.

[kgrad5]

hand 1: i think i would get as many bets in as possible but beware a capped turn, if the turn does get capped.. pray for the board to pair

hand 2: i think i would play this fast too, if you hit a sf the ace will give you all the action you could ever want and people will stay drawing to the ace and even if you get another club you have the third nuts, it all depends on the situation and reads on players

[tiltaholic]

I don't play 6 handed, but:
I'd raise both for sure.

In hand 2 what is the question, call or raise? I don't see how calling could be good. And folding is not an option... Is that also a 6 handed table?
-t

[spacemonkey57]

Raise both of them and see how much everyone else likes their hand. In the first hand if an eight or a queen falls on the turn then you can worry. In the second one you've got the nut straight, a gutshot straight flush draw, and the third nut flush draw. I'd jam the pot on the flop and see what the turn and river bring.

[tardigrade]

For the first hand, since you can easily improve to a full house, I think you have to play it very aggressively. There are a quite a few hands that will stick with you, so you should try to get paid while you are probably ahead while getting rid of the more ridiculous inside straight draws.

The second hand is trickier, but I still think you want to at least start out strong. You have a pretty high club in hand, and you can probably get higher clubs to fold before the river if you hit the pot hard enough. If you are getting played back into strongly, then you may want to call down or give up. I think chances are reasonable you are still ahead when the flop hits, though, so try to get the higher clubs out of the pot.

[bisonbison]

Cash, you gain nothing from playing it slow.

Hand 1: 95% of the time, you have the best hand. Apparently, SB and UTG are willing to call bets on the flop - so let them. There are quite a few cards that will kill your action, even if it turns out you're still ahead (a 7 or a K), so get your action now.

The same thing applies to hand 2. probably 90% of the time you have the best hand and a decent draw, but if another club falls it'll be tough to get money from people who are behind you, and you won't know if you're behind until showdown. so raise.

[chief444]

raise, raise.

On coordinated boards I don't slowplay. It normally will just result in missed bets.

[sfer]

I jam them like Bob Marley on speed. When someone tells me I'm beat Bunky-style I slow down.

[tech]

Raise both.

[chesspain]

[ QUOTE ]
You have a pretty high club in hand, and you can probably get higher clubs to fold before the river if you hit the pot hard enough.

[/ QUOTE ]

You must be on drugs if you think that the K or A of clubs is going to lay down before the river.

[Jaran]

Hey Cold,
I'm raising in both cases. In hand one, I don't want someone with 8x or Qx to feel comfortable, even though they are right coming along. Also, you prolly have the best hand right now. Hand 2, I'm also raising. If there is a made flush out there, so be it.

-Jaran

[SofaCoach]

Bet the bejeezus out of both. Cap if possible.

[parachute]

[ QUOTE ]

I usually lean towards playing these fast, as I don't like to give credit for a flopped monster. On the other hand, it sucks when you play these fast and the turn/river ends up bringing the fourth card to a straight or flush.


[/ QUOTE ]

The reason to play it fast is exactly because the turn or river might make a four-straight or -flush. You want to make your opponents pay to see that card.

Slow-playing is for the opposite kind of situation, where you're not scared at all of future cards.

[Peter Harris]

raise both flops, buddy. like bison says, he isn't pooh bear for nothing.

Isn't it funny how a bear likes hunny?
Pete Harris

[k000k]

[ QUOTE ]
Preflop: Hero 9/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="666666">2 folds</font>, SB calls, <font color="666666">1 fold</font>, UTG calls.
Flop: (7 SB) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">SB bets</font>, UTG calls, Hero...


[/ QUOTE ]
EASY raise.. You hit your set and have 10 outs to improve to some extremely tough nutz...

[ QUOTE ]

Hand 2 (I don't have the HH, so I'm going from memory)
Hero is BB with J /images/graemlins/club.gif 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif
5 limpers, Hero checks.
Flop: Q /images/graemlins/club.gif T /images/graemlins/club.gif 8 /images/graemlins/club.gif
SB bets, Hero...


[/ QUOTE ]
I raise.. You MUST play straights fast cuz they're almost always vulnerable, and it REALLY is here. You have one of the flush cards, which reduces the chances of someone else holding 2.. You're on the same flush draw they are, hopefully the A/K aren't out there.. Lets see that 9/images/graemlins/club.gif drop, you have 2 chances at the stone cold nutz.. 2 chances at 3rd flush, and if it doesn't happen, you still have a good hand to fall back on.. I don't give credit for a flopped flush until I encounter some serious resistance. If I get 3bet or capped on the turn or riv, THEN I'll start worrying about that..

[cold_cash]

I raised both of these flops, just for the record.

I lost Hand 1. The river put an open ender out there, and someone, of course, had a King.

Hand 2 I won with my straight.

I was just wondering, is there ever a situation where you would take a "wait and see" approach with these kinds of hands. I understand not "slowplaying" them, because obviously neither hand is good enough to truly slowplay; in fact, it's just the opposite.

I'm not trying to be fancy, or make "big league" plays, I'm just posing a question.

Let's say you check your option in the big blind with a pair of deuces. The flop comes 2TJ, all hearts. You have 7 opponents, and the SB checks to you. Do you go full tilt until another heart comes off?

[cold_cash]

[ QUOTE ]
Is that also a 6 handed table?

[/ QUOTE ]

Both of these were at a 10 handed table. I don't know if we were down to 6 players, though that could have been a possibility.

[SnakeRat]

hey cold, it says the number of players in the hand history, yep 6 players /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[cold_cash]

[ QUOTE ]
Slow-playing is for the opposite kind of situation, where you're not scared at all of future cards.


[/ QUOTE ]

I understand this. I didn't mean for the question to come off like, "Should I slowplay these flops?"

I was just curious if anyone ever "plays them slowly", as opposed to "slowplaying" them. Know what I mean?

[cold_cash]

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: 95% of the time, you have the best hand. Apparently, SB and UTG are willing to call bets on the flop - so let them. There are quite a few cards that will kill your action, even if it turns out you're still ahead (a 7 or a K), so get your action now.

The same thing applies to hand 2. probably 90% of the time you have the best hand and a decent draw, but if another club falls it'll be tough to get money from people who are behind you, and you won't know if you're behind until showdown. so raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

Very good points, Bison.

Let me ask you this - How much, if it all, should the number of opponents alter my strategy?

For instance, do you take this same line in both an 8 handed pot and a 3 handed pot?