Poker Hands EV Chart? Any inaccuracies or shortcomings?

[digdeep]

Recently came across this EV chart for beginning hands in hold'em; the link is Hold'Em Hands EV (http://teamfu.freeshell.org/poker_hands.html) (scroll down on page) and I was curious what, if any, inaccuracies there might be in this chart? The chart is based off of 115,591,080 hands played at PokerRoom. Is this a good benchmark to use, what does one need to be cognisant of when using this to gauge the strength of beginning hold'em hands?

Thanks

[TomCollins]

There are many hands that are fairly low on the list because people don't know how to play them well and consequently lose a lot of money.

Notice most of the worst cards are suited. This is because the any suited two will do strategy is very poor. It does not mean that 32o is better than 32s. People just tend to do more stupid stuff with 32s. I think the biggest thing you can do with this chart is use it as a beginner to stay away with cheese like T4s and Q6 os. For example 22 loses quite a bit of money, but K8s makes money. But I'd rather play 22 than K8s in most games.

It's not a bad chart if you are just starting out and need some convincing to drop that extra cheese, but Sklansky's Groups are a lot better if you are looking for strategic advice.

[digdeep]

I appreciate your response Tom. I was trying to determine exactly what you mentioned; how a player's skill level and strategic knowledge changes the value of a hand in an EV chart like this one. Considering that the majority of players will correctly play AA, KK, and QQ, I am curious at how incorrect play of weaker hands, by the majority of players, contributes to their EV. It would seem that incorrect play would generally lower the EV, but by how much? What percentage of players would one guess plays all hands, but particularly weaker hands, incorrectly?

[TomCollins]

Take 48s. I guarantee I am losing less than .08 BB/hand on it. If I get it it in the blind 1/10th of the time, and if I get it in the small blind 1/10th of the time, then I will lose .1 * .5 + .1 * .25 = .075 BB/hand. Folding it every other time and assuming I NEVER win a hand with it in the big blind, I will do better than most people here, even though this is suboptimal play.

[citizenkn]

[ QUOTE ]
I appreciate your response Tom. I was trying to determine exactly what you mentioned; how a player's skill level and strategic knowledge changes the value of a hand in an EV chart like this one. Considering that the majority of players will correctly play AA, KK, and QQ, I am curious at how incorrect play of weaker hands, by the majority of players, contributes to their EV. It would seem that incorrect play would generally lower the EV, but by how much? What percentage of players would one guess plays all hands, but particularly weaker hands, incorrectly?

[/ QUOTE ]

Here's one example of a play by an inexperienced player that can lower the EV of a hand (my dad played this hand yesterday, and he got a stern talking to):

Dad is on the button with 9-10 of diamonds. UTG raises, all fold to my dad, who calls (-EV mistake #1). BB calls.

Flop is 9-4-3. Dad has hit a hand, but NOT the straight draw or flush draw that one would generally be wanting with this hand. UTG bets, and my dad just calls him all the way to the river (-EV mistakes 2,3, and 4), and shockingly loses to JJ.

In other words, inexperienced players will:

A. Play mediocre drawing hands in inappropriate situations.
B. Play those hands much further than they should.

But experienced players can turn those same hands into +EV hands by playing them only in the right circumstances, and by knowing when to fold if the flop doesn't hit properly.