What's the Best Move? $100 NL Commerce.

[DerrekL]

$100 NL Holdem cash game with $2 and $3 blinds.
I have $220 and am in late middle position.

All players fold to the player on my immediate right. He limps. I hold Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif J /images/graemlins/spade.gif. For the most part if no one raises at this table all late position players plus small blind limp. No raise = at least 6 players seeing the flop. I haven't been limping much at all, mostly If I was playing at all I'd raise, and I was seeing hardly any flops. I make it $10. Button calls, SB calls, BB calls, guy to my right calls. Guess a raise doesn't narrow the field either /images/graemlins/frown.gif

After drop the pot stands at $46.

Flop: J /images/graemlins/heart.gif 8 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 6 /images/graemlins/spade.gif

Dude to my right bets $15. This guy, from his actions thus far, was a novice NL player playing like a limit player. He can't fold any flush or straight draw, and he makes questionable decisions pre-flop. Earlier he called me all in for $100 pre-flop with J /images/graemlins/club.gif Q /images/graemlins/club.gif He, however, was getting lucky and had a stack of $700.

I raise it to $55. Everyone fold to the SB who is playing his second hand at the table, and thus I have no idea what he's capable of. SB moves all in for $90. After check-raising all-in I figure the guy for trips, or maybe A-J. Dude to my right thinks for 1 minute and then calls. In my opinion he might hold any straight or any flush draw plus two pair, trips or A-J, he's been gambling it up for the last few hands because he's been hitting. Thus far I've never seen him raise anyone no matter his hand. He either bets if no one else has or calls.

Pot is about $280 and it's $35 to me.
1.) What's the best move? Fold, Call, Raise all-in?

I call. Turn K /images/graemlins/spade.gif

2.) Holding the second best possible hand, if Dude to my right checks what do you do? Check,or move all-in for about $120?

3.) If the Dude to my right moves all-in what do you do? Fold or Call?

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
Pot is about $280 and it's $35 to me.
1.) What's the best move? Fold, Call, Raise all-in?


[/ QUOTE ]

Well, you usually can't re-raise an all-in raise that is less than a full raise. So you might be limited to fold or call. Obviously you can't fold here. So call. If you are allowed to raise here, I'd go all-in.

[ QUOTE ]
2.) Holding the second best possible hand, if Dude to my right checks what do you do? Check,or move all-in for about $120?

[/ QUOTE ]

With $280 in the pot, I probably do something silly like bet $60. Doesn't really matter all that much. I wouldn't check though. Prob bet $50-75 or all-in. The $50ish bet serves a purpose of making the pot $380 if he calls and now on the river it's v. tempting for him to call $70 w/ just one pair.

[ QUOTE ]
3.) If the Dude to my right moves all-in what do you do? Fold or Call?

[/ QUOTE ]

Easy call.

[DerrekL]

Would your answer to 1. above change if I thought the "Dude to my right" had been playing tightly and solidly?

You are right about the raising situation. I can't recall the exact numbers here, but had I pushed all-in the dealer probably wouldn't have caught it anyhow /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[AnyutaDva]

Obviously on the flop you are not even thinking of passing. In UK casinos you aren't allowed to reraise an underraise so the only option would be to call. If I had the option to raise I would probably still only call because I figure I am going to make better decisions than the novice player so I want to give myself the chance to do that.

You must like the turn, especially against a novice player. If he pushes I'd call in a heartbeat. If he checks I'd bet all-in. He isn't a tough player who is likely to make a good fold against you, you are only betting 2/5 of the pot, he'll call you with a lower flush, two pair and possibly even top pair or the straight draw. If you find him with the nut flush then you have been unlucky.

[DerrekL]

Ok let's make this harder by fictitously changing my reads. Let's say both opponents in this pot were tough aggressive solid players. Would you play it the same?

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Pot is about $280 and it's $35 to me.
1.) What's the best move? Fold, Call, Raise all-in?


[/ QUOTE ]

Well, you usually can't re-raise an all-in raise that is less than a full raise. So you might be limited to fold or call. Obviously you can't fold here. So call. If you are allowed to raise here, I'd go all-in.


[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, you'd love to be all-in here. i very rarely have my [censored] together enough to think of this during a hand, but this is actually a good reason to raise a little less, up to 50. then if the small stack pushes it'll be a raise of 40 over your 40, and if Other Dude calls you can push.

and i agree with everything el diablo wrote. one argument for pushing on the turn is that Dude sounds like the kind of guy who would call with a naked T /images/graemlins/spade.gif or something (but would not call the river if he missed and had no pair). i still prefer betting 50 or 60.

[DerrekL]

Alright, let's make this even more difficult.
How would your answers change, or would they, if the SB check raised me all-in for my whole stack of $220 instead of $100? Let's assume the "Dude" still calls.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
Would your answer to 1. above change if I thought the "Dude to my right" had been playing tightly and solidly?


[/ QUOTE ]

No. It wouldn't change any of my comments.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
Alright, let's make this even more difficult.
How would your answers change, or would they, if the SB check raised me all-in for my whole stack of $220 instead of $100? Let's assume the "Dude" still calls.

[/ QUOTE ]

Easy call.

Really, nothing you say will change the comments. With these stacks, this hand plays itself. You're happy to have it all go in on the flop. If that doesn't happen, once you make your flush, you want the rest of the money in.

[DerrekL]

I agree with you and I believe I just got in a tight spot here.

[Ulysses]

BTW, I just re-read the post. I had focused just on the post-flop action. Pre-flop in a game as you described it, I think limping w/ your hand is much better than raising to $10.

[DerrekL]

I agree with what everyone else has posted. Thanks for the posts.

The river came 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif

SB turned over 8-8 for quads.
Dude to my right turned over A/images/graemlins/spade.gif 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif

So it turned out I needed runner runer jacks or queens to win!! However, I can't see playing this hand much differently.

I second guessed myself at the table, because two others were like, "What on earth could you put the other two on besides those two hands?" They thought I should've folded for the $40 on the flop. I thought to myself that if I played that cautiously, in general, I'd get throttled.

[DerrekL]

I agree, I typically limp with it. I raised hoping to isolate the "Dude to my right". I probably should've raised more or just limped. Additionally, to this point I had gotten A-k a lot plus kings and aces and I hadn't entered yet without a raise so I decided to stick with super aggro image.