Anybody check-fold this river

[spacemonkey57]

First orbit at the table, no solid reads. I think this is straightforward til the river. Anyone disagree? I figured he probably had me but I was getting 12-1 on the call. Thanks in advance.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif. CO posts a blind of $0.50. MP3 posts a blind of $0.75.
UTG calls, <font color="666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="666666">1 fold</font>, MP3 (poster) checks, CO (poster) checks, <font color="666666">1 fold</font>, SB completes, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, CO calls, SB folds.

Flop: (11.50 SB) 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(5 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG folds, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, CO calls.

Turn: (7.75 BB) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP1 folds, <font color="CC3333">MP3 raises</font>, CO folds, Hero calls.

River: (11.75 BB) K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="CC3333">MP3 bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 13.75 BB
<font color="green">Main Pot: 13.75 BB, between Hero and MP3.</font> &gt; <font color="white">Pot won by MP3 (13.75 BB).</font>

Results in white below: <font color="white">
Hero shows Ac Qh (two pair, queens and eights).
MP3 shows Kh 8d (full house, eights full of kings).
Outcome: MP3 wins 13.75 BB. </font>

[Yeknom58]

once I called the turn raise, there is pretty much no river card that will make me fold. Fold on the turn raise IF your going to fold and I probably wouldn't unless I had a read.

[bakku]

I call this down with no read on the player.

Also, if you're going to call the turn raise call the river. Do you see why?

[spacemonkey57]

[ QUOTE ]
I call this down with no read on the player.

Also, if you're going to call the turn raise call the river. Do you see why?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because the pot's too big to fold for one bet? Also if he already had me beat on the turn that king doesn't matter one way or the other.

[afk]

[ QUOTE ]
Also, if you're going to call the turn raise call the river. Do you see why?

[/ QUOTE ]

No. Spell it out for me, brotha. This is one concept that I haven't learned the reasoning to yet. Any help would be appreciated. Does it have anything to do with MP3 possibly bluffing when the board pairs on the turn? Or am I way out in left field?

[bakku]

[ QUOTE ]
Also if he already had me beat on the turn that king doesn't matter one way or the other.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yep, you're calling the turn because you think there's a chance you might be ahead and the river card more than likely doesn't change anything. Once you call the turn you're committed to calling the river. If you know he has an 8 you should fold on the turn to the raise because you're drawing to a 2 outer and have insufficient pot odds to see the river.

[HajiShirazu]

[ QUOTE ]
Do you see why?

[/ QUOTE ]
This is the second DYSW today. Let's not let this become an epidemic, guys.

[Chris Daddy Cool]

Um... how about because its just stupid to call a turn bet knowing you'll fold the river no matter what. I see it all the time... Hero has QQ. Turn is an A. He check/calls the turn only to fold to the river. Its just stupid poker, thats why.

Here's a lesson for you guys:
If you feel like folding what you think are two outers, do it on the turn, not the river.

[bakku]

I didn't see the other one and I almost never use that line unless it's some 'witty remark.' I just couldn't think of another phrase to use.

[bakku]

Mr. I-really-need-to-pee's explanation is a lot clearer than mine, but we're both saying the same thing.

[Chris Daddy Cool]

You shall now be called Junior Sklansky. Do you see why?