cardroom attitude

I was playing in a bigish bay area cardroom last night. I play there somewhat often for their 9-18 game, but not anything you could call regularly. The reason I stopped by was because they have a big tournament going on, and they spread a 20 game during the tournament.


Anyway, they don't comp food for there, but they give out 5$ food coupons for 9-18 players. While sitting in the 20 game, I got a little hungry and asked for a coupon. The floor told me that they only give out coupons to 9-18 players, but he'd make an exception for me because I sat in the 9 game before the 20 started. He then went on about how the 9-18 is their main game during most of the year, and that they wanted to cultivate those players. WTH?


I went back to my table and chewed on this for a while when I realized that the entire table of 20 players were pretty much regular customers. Not a new face in the bunch. They could get this game off the ground on a regular basis if they wanted to, but they choose not to, I guess. Why, I don't know.


Does this sound like strange logic to anyone? If anything, I was reminded why I don't play there regularly even though the food's better than my regular room and it's just as close.


as an aside, I finally stopped my losing slide. whew.

Hi Matt,

Haven't spoken to you for a long time...I met your friend Randy, who from the description of yourself you gave me, I thought was you! /images/smile.gif


Anyway, the attitudes/perceptions of the Casino San Pablo floorpeople are indeed, uhh, inconsistent. I.e., I'll be playing 6-12 and hustling to get enough people to play 9-18, and ask for a food ticket. Tong or Luay or somebody else gives me the "You must be playing 9-18 to get one, Dan." My imagined reply is 'No shit, ya think maybe you could start one?'...which, of course, I'm too polite to verbalize.


I really like playing at CSP more than the Oaks, but their inability to maiintain even lower-mid limit games is nauseating. I asked Doug (the head prop) why they don't spread 12-24 or 15-30. Apparently, they want to get lists for limit which don't conflict with the Grand or the Oaks. It's viewpoints like that that will make you and I and others continue to have to go to the Chances if you want to play midlimit.


Dan


P.S. Have you noticed that as the economy has gone to shit the Grand (barely ever play there) and CSP 12-24 and 9-18 have gotten even juicier?

Hey Dan,

good to hear you're doing well. I agree with much of what you wrote. except for the part about my looking like Randy. I'm much better looking.

Actually, we could be taken for one another if you just go off of a description.


anyway, I think part of the problem is their apparent hiring from within policy. It seems like they hire a bunch of dealers, and the good ones get their experience and then move to LC where they get treated better. From the pool of what's left, they choose their floormen, and they eventually move on up. Promoting from within is a great way to go, but I think you have to be able to differentiate potential from deadwood. All of the floor level management that they have now has been with them since the opening, and some of them were brutal dealers. How they moved up is beyond me.


I agree with you about the games and economy. Maybe it's all the out of work stock people who are used to the action. Maybe some people who have some money left over see poker as another form of pre-IPO stock options (either hit it big or bottom out). Either way, the frenzy has hit even the Oaks 15 game which, at times is uncontrollable. Great stuff if you can get a seat.

I don't know if they've recently tightened up on the food comp tickets, but when I ask for one, they usually give it to me regardless of the game I'm in. Maybe 'cuz I'm a fish and they don't want to tap the aquarium! (My secret's out).


I think they could spread a regular 20 game if they put out the word that they're willing to spread one. There is some popular support, and, in my usual grass roots effort, I usually put my name up to start an "interest" list. They used to spread a regular and very good 15-30 game a few years back, but decided to promote the 9-18 game instead on the basis of a double jack-pot. This move killed the 15-30 game, and those regulars from the 15 took their games on the road to the Oaks or across the bay. In addition, I think the regular "contributors" to the game went broke.


In talking to some people over there, including Danny Twitchen (the PM) and Robo, the prevailing attitude/fear is that many people will go broke in the bigger games, and broke players don't come to the club at all. I don't know whether that's bull-feces or not, but it seems to be one of the several stories I've been told by various people. Robo's comment about spreading similar limits as the Grand & Oaks is a pretty silly reason not to spread a bigger game, but I wouldn't doubt that it is a factor.


If you want a regular 20 game (like I do), a past strategy I've used to some success is to find someone willing to play short-handed or heads-up, and get one rolling that way. I've never seen them turn down a request for a dealer, even in a heads-up game. Ultimately, if you build it, they will come. We've started some great games that way.


I figure if they can spread a fairly regular no-limit mexican stud game, a regular 20 game should be a snap.

I like the idea of starting a short game, but the board is usually clueless, and won't start games 5 handed. How likely are they to start one heads up? I find it much easier to point my car to the Oaks, AJ's or LC's to find a mid limit game than to roll the dice and go to CSP.

Also, the idea of mid limit games breaking their players is kind of pollyanna-ish. They think people won't go broke in the 9 game? I regularly see people in that game for three plus racks. Rather than be over protective of the customer base they already have, they should try to build up a new one. A player that busts in a 20 game will soon be back in the lower limit games, so I don't think they lose this player. the ones they do lose are the ones, like myself, who've "graduated" from the top limit they spread, and are forced to look elsewhere for a suitable game. the food's good, the place is nice and (some) staff is pretty attractive, but all that won't bring me in if the game isn't there.